Mikrotik SXT LTE

[niceday]

Hi All, I purchased the sxt lte lit but my results are actually worse than using my huawei b525 router on three, I read on a thread that the Iskra l700 antenna might ne a better choice. Any opinions would be very helpful. I can access band 3 and 20 and the tower is about 1-5 km away. Thanks for your time

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That should be 1.5km sorry

[Seán]

Try checking what speed you get with the SXT LTE set to band 3, which has much higher bandwidth than band 20. You may need to fine tune the direction to get the SINR value as high as possible as it's more sensitive to alignment than band 20.

If the speed is no better, post a screenshot of your band 3 cellular readings. This will give me an idea of which antenna is worth getting.

Based on your band 20 readings, you have a very strong signal and reasonably good SINR for band 20. If the readings are similar on band 3, the Iskra P-58 L700 could be overkill as this would be a clear sign that the poor performance is due to network contention rather than the signal.

The SXT LTE does however have a few drawbacks compared to the B525. It is not capable of carrier aggregation (unless it's the LTE6 model), which means it cannot combine the available bandwidth of both bands 3 and 20 like the B525 can. It has a 10/100Mbps Ethernet socket, which limits the top speed to just under 100Mbps.

[niceday]

Try checking what speed you get with the SXT LTE set to band 3, which has much higher bandwidth than band 20.  You may need to fine tune the direction to get the SINR value as high as possible as it's more sensitive to alignment than band 20.

If the speed is no better, post a screenshot of your band 3 cellular readings.  This will give me an idea of which antenna is worth getting. 

Based on your band 20 readings, you have a very strong signal and reasonably good SINR for band 20.  If the readings are similar on band 3, the Iskra P-58 L700 could be overkill as this would be a clear sign that the poor performance is due to network contention rather than the signal.

The SXT LTE does however have a few drawbacks compared to the B525.  It is not capable of carrier aggregation (unless it's the LTE6 model), which means it cannot combine the available bandwidth of both bands 3 and 20 like the B525 can.  It has a 10/100Mbps Ethernet socket, which limits the top speed to just under 100Mbps.

Hi Sean, Thanks so much for the reply. I posted two pictures of the signal strength on band 3 and the fact that the speeds vary wildly , I am hoping it is not contention. Thanks for your time

[Seán]

Unfortunately, it's not looking like a signal issue as your signal readings are also very good on band 3. With a quiet cell, I would expect around 70-100Mbps just on band 3 with those RSRP and SINR readings.

Just to rule out a packet loss issue, try downloading the 100MB test file from either of the following sites:
https://ams-nl-ping.vultr.com/
https://fra-de-ping.vultr.com/

If they download much quicker, then the issue is packet loss on the mast's backhaul, a problem I face with the mast I'm connected to. That host uses the TCP BBR protocol, which is immune to minor packet loss, so it will download as fast as the bandwidth available. If however, downloads as slow as your other downloads, then it's very likely congestion either on the that mast or with its backhaul.

If you still wish to go ahead with the antenna, I suggest going for a panel antenna (e.g. LowcostMobile 700-2600MHz) for easier installation with the Huawei B525 as you can mount it on a basic TV antenna wall mount. The Iskra P-58 L700 is overkill with those readings and would need to be mounted on a long pole to separate one antenna by 60-90cm from the other.

[niceday]

Hi Sean, they downloaded a little quicker than other , still massive spikes on the graph for speed on winbox. If it is a contention issue then is there anything I can do , would it still be worth getting the antenna you mentioned . Thanks

[Seán]

Try selecting band 1 to see if you pick up anything on it. Even if it's a weak signal, try a speed test as it could mean it's from a more distant less congested mast. It's a pity that neither the B525 nor the SXT LTE support band 28 as there is a possibility of picking up a more distant less congested mast operating on this temporary band, which travels a lot further due to the low frequency. As bands 28 (and 4G band 1) are temporary 4G bands set to expire on the 1st April, I would hold off purchasing any other router until ComReg's multi spectrum auction takes place.

A few other tests worth trying are 3G bands 8 and 1 with the SXT LTE. The 3G bands are quiet in many areas due to most phones and routers being 4G capable and automatically operating in 4G mode. With quiet cells, I've seen up to about 18Mbps on 3G band 8 and around 30Mbps on 3G band 1.

As a test run to see if an antenna will help, when it's dry outside, place your Huawei B525 outside on the side of the house facing the mast, e.g. use a long extension lead. Test to see how its performance compares with inside. If there is some improvement, you should get at least this with either antenna. If there is no change in performance compared to what the router gets inside, then I suggest not getting one.

[niceday]

Try selecting band 1 to see if you pick up anything on it.  Even if it's a weak signal, try a speed test as it could mean it's from a more distant less congested mast.  It's a pity that neither the B525 nor the SXT LTE support band 28 as there is a possibility of picking up a more distant less congested mast operating on this temporary band, which travels a lot further due to the low frequency.  As bands 28 (and 4G band 1) are temporary 4G bands set to expire on the 1st April, I would hold off purchasing any other router until ComReg's multi spectrum auction takes place. 

A few other tests worth trying are 3G bands 8 and 1 with the SXT LTE.  The 3G bands are quiet in many areas due to most phones and routers being 4G capable and automatically operating in 4G mode.  With quiet cells, I've seen up to about 18Mbps on 3G band 8 and around 30Mbps on 3G band 1.

As a test run to see if an antenna will help, when it's dry outside, place your Huawei B525 outside on the side of the house facing the mast, e.g. use a long extension lead.  Test to see how its performance compares with inside.  If there is some improvement, you should get at least this with either antenna.  If there is no change in performance compared to what the router gets inside, then I suggest not getting one.

Again thanks so much for the reply, I will try that out and get back to you tomorrow . Thanks Sean

[niceday]

Sean, the three network was actually down here until an hour ago. I will carry out those tests tomorrow. Thanks Sean

[niceday]

Sean, I haven't forgotten. The network is actually down for the last 3 days. It is very unusual and frustrating. As soon as it is back I will test.Thanks

[niceday]

Sean, three upgraded the mast it seems and now the speeds are up to 40mb now. This is on the sxt. Would it still be better to go with the antenna and take advantage of carrier aggregation of the Huawei b525 . Is carrier aggregation always better than single band?. Thanks Sean.

[Seán]

That explains the outage, it looks like they were busy upgrading the backhaul link to the mast.

Carrier Aggregation generally performs better when the backhaul link is not saturated, in which case it can give faster speed by combining the available bandwidth of both bands. Otherwise it will perform no better than using a single band. I suggest checking your speed again with the B525 inside vs outside.

[niceday]

Hi Sean
I have checked the b525 both inside and outside and there is a speed difference outside(faster by about 20%). I have a few questions please.
1: Which would be better the mikrotik sxt lte6 with carrier aggregation or the external antenna you recommended, why I ask is would the speed gains of the external antenna be lost in the 10m cable? If the LTE6 has carrier aggregation I assume the speed loss in the Cat5/6 cable would be less than the cable used for the external antenna.
2: My phone also on three performed faster than the sxt and router outside in the test outside and inside and it has 4g+ symbol this is why I am wondering about the sxt LTeE6

Again thanks very much for your time

[Seán]

Based on issues I've heard with the MikroTik LHG LTE6, I would avoid the SXT LTE6 as it uses the same modem. Emilia goes into detail here about the issues she experienced with the LHG LTE6 model.

With your signal strength, you will not have any speed degradation unless you add a lot of cable extensions. A good quality coaxial cable will lose around 0.5dB per metre at 1800MHz, so 10 metres will likely reduce the RSRP by about 5dB. The signal strength only becomes an issue once the RSRP approaches -100dBm, after which the signal level starts to fall below the noise floor level of the router's radio. If an antenna up a similar -75dBm signal strength at the antenna as your MikroTik kit, you can get away with up to about 50 metres of cable before it starts affecting the download speed. The upload speed begins to degrade once the RSRP falls below about -90dBm.

It is only if you are in a weak signal area that every metre of cable matters. For example, if your SXT had a -100dBm RSRP reading, then you definitely would want to keep the antenna leads as short as possible. The main benefit with the outdoor LTE kits such as your SXT LTE is that these are easier to install for installers, i.e. they can go to a site and install it without first having to check if the indoor unit can be placed close enough and that it only needs a single cable run and drill hole.

[niceday]

Thanks for the very detailed reply, so would the lo lowcostmobile antenna be the best solution for me. If so is Amazon the only place to buy. Thanks

[Seán]

The lowcostmobile or the similar Poynting XPOL-2. Each can mount on a typical TV antenna mount. The Poynting XPOL-2 is available at a few Irish stores such as novatel.ie and irishwireless.net. The pricing is similar, around €120-€140 + delivery. Just make sure it's the XPOL-2 as the XPOL-1 series is omni-directional. The XPOL-2-5G is about 3dB more sensitive and supports the 3.6GHz 5G band, but costs a lot more.

Lowcostmobile 700-2600MHz antenna: https://smile.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01E7CWNSI/
Poynting XPOL-2: https://www.novatel.ie/9dbi-cross-polari...nna-xpol-2
Poynting XPOL-2-5G: https://www.novatel.ie/wifi-lte-4g-5g-ex...er-antenna

The Poynting has 5m leads whereas the lowcostmobile one has 10m leads.

[Liam]

Hi all, 

I have the SXT LTE 6 and I have to say while I generally hover around 10mb down 20 up I have hit 60mb down on occasions. I find the SXT never gives a steadyish speed through the day even when it's off peak. I will attach my readings below but I'm wondering should I look at a log antenna and a chateau ?

[Seán]

Your band 3 readings appear to be very good on the SXT LTE6. Have a check what the band 20 reads by selecting just band 20. If the SINR is also above 5dB, then a panel antenna should be adequate, like one of which I suggested in the above post.

A pair of LOG antennas are more sensitive on band 20, particularly where the SINR is very low, however, they require a long pole to provide enough separation between each antenna. If the mast is high up on a hill, you may need a second pole and a pipe cross clamp to mount the two side-by-side to tilt them up.

Based on your speed readings, it looks like contention is the main issue with the mast such as a congested backhaul, like the issue the user niceday had above before Three upgraded the mast.

[niceday]

The lowcostmobile or the similar Poynting XPOL-2.  Each can mount on a typical TV antenna mount.  The Poynting XPOL-2 is available at a few Irish stores such as novatel.ie and irishwireless.net.  The pricing is similar, around €120-€140 + delivery.  Just make sure it's the XPOL-2 as the XPOL-1 series is omni-directional.  The XPOL-2-5G is about 3dB more sensitive and supports the 3.6GHz 5G band, but costs a lot more. 

Lowcostmobile 700-2600MHz antenna: https://smile.amazon.co.uk/dp/B01E7CWNSI/
Poynting XPOL-2: https://www.novatel.ie/9dbi-cross-polari...nna-xpol-2
Poynting XPOL-2-5G: https://www.novatel.ie/wifi-lte-4g-5g-ex...er-antenna

The Poynting has 5m leads whereas the lowcostmobile one has 10m leads.

Thanks Sean I will look through all that and pick one, Thanks for all your help this week. I have learned a lot and appreciate the time you spent replying. Thanks Sean

[Liam]

Your band 3 readings appear to be very good on the SXT LTE6.  Have a check what the band 20 reads by selecting just band 20.  If the SINR is also above 5dB, then a panel antenna should be adequate, like one of which I suggested in the above post. 

A pair of LOG antennas are more sensitive on band 20, particularly where the SINR is very low, however, they require a long pole to provide enough separation between each antenna.  If the mast is high up on a hill, you may need a second pole and a pipe cross clamp to mount the two side-by-side to tilt them up. 

Based on your speed readings, it looks like contention is the main issue with the mast such as a congested backhaul, like the issue the user niceday had above before Three upgraded the mast.

Thanks for that info Seán,do you mean band 1 or 3? My band 20 readings have me on 3g hspa+ so I don't get a SINR reading for it, the mast is below me 4.5km away I have the SXT installed on gable of house prob 25ft or so  with a 15° tilt downwards. 

I actually used your suggestion in another post to align using band 3 as that would be the most sensitive to align. This may be a stupid question but would triple or quad CA give me higher speeds even though there's backhaul congestion?

[Seán]

Sorry, I misread the screenshot as usually I see band 3 aggregated with band 20. I'm actually surprised it did not aggregate band 1 with 3, unless band 3 is being served from another mast.

In the band selection list, try selecting just bands 1 and 3 to see if it will aggregate these two together, i.e. it should show one as the primary band and the other as the CA band on the status screen.

Unfortunately, triple CA will not get around around backhaul congestion, at least not until Three upgrades the backhaul. It will just give a faster link between you and the mast, which is not where the bottleneck lies. If the congestion was with the mast itself (i.e. RSRQ constantly -12dB or more negative) then triple CA can improve the speed by aggregating the available bandwidth of 3 carriers.

Indeed band 3 (or 1) is generally what I use for aligning a mast as these higher frequencies are more sensitive to accurate alignment. Band 20 readings on the other hand are what I usually check to see which antenna to choose or whether it's worth upgrading the antenna, particularly when using band 20 (or 28) with carrier aggregation. If the SINR is very poor, it means there's a lot of interference. This requires an antenna with higher gain across the 700-900MHz range to isolate lower bands from interference. With a reasonably good SINR, then a panel antenna would be a better choice for ease of installation.